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	<title>cereus &#8211; Thinking Poker</title>
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	<description>Weekly poker podcast hosted by Andrew Brokos and Nate Meyvis featuring interviews with famous and behind-the-scenes figures from the poker world as well as an in-depth poker strategy segment.</description>
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	<itunes:author>Andrew Brokos and Carlos Welch</itunes:author>
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	<item>
		<title>Rats Flee Sinking Ship</title>
		<link>https://www.thinkingpoker.net/2010/12/rats-flee-sinking-ship/</link>
					<comments>https://www.thinkingpoker.net/2010/12/rats-flee-sinking-ship/#comments</comments>
		
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Andrew]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 31 Dec 2010 17:46:31 +0000</pubDate>
				<category><![CDATA[Poker News]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[Absolute Poker]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[Annie Duke]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[ap]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[cereus]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[cheating]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[Joe Sebok]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[online poker cheating]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[Phil Hellmuth]]></category>
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		<category><![CDATA[poker cheating]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[ub]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[Ultimate Bet]]></category>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thinkingpoker.net/?p=6954</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[From Annie Duke&#8217;s website: It’s bittersweet, but I’ve decided to leave UB. I have nothing but positive things to say about UB and my experiences with the brand, management team, and dedicated employees who work hard every day to deliver ... <a class="read-more" href="https://www.thinkingpoker.net/2010/12/rats-flee-sinking-ship/">Read more...</a>]]></description>
										<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>From <a href="http://www.annieduke.com/2010/12/moving-on/" target="_blank" rel="noopener">Annie Duke&#8217;s website</a>:</p>
<blockquote><p>It’s bittersweet, but I’ve <a title="Annie Duke leaving UB" href="http://blog.ub.com/2010/12/annie-duke-leaving-ub-poker/" target="_blank" rel="noopener">decided to leave UB</a>.</p>
<p>I have nothing but positive things to say about UB and my experiences  with the brand, management team, and dedicated employees who work hard  every day to deliver a terrific online poker experience for players like  you.</p>
<p>I’ve sincerely enjoyed wearing the UB patch, but it’s time for me to move on.</p>
<p>So why am I leaving UB? In a nutshell, professional and personal growth.</p></blockquote>
<p>Translation: &#8220;They can&#8217;t afford to pay me and/or I don&#8217;t want to go to jail.&#8221; There&#8217;s been some speculation that perhaps Annie no longer wants to be associated with some of the biggest scumbags in the industry, but she&#8217;s stood by them for some time through a <a href="https://www.thinkingpoker.net/Blog/2008/05/ultimate-bet-superuser-scandal.html">huge cheating scandal</a> and repeated attempts to cover it up. Something has changed, and I&#8217;m guessing it&#8217;s their willingness or ability to pay her.</p>
<p>From <a href="http://www.philhellmuth.com/news/poker-tweets-blog/index.html" target="_blank" rel="noopener">Phil Hellmuth&#8217;s Twitter</a>:</p>
<blockquote><p>Making a BIG move&#8230;leaving UB. Truly lots of great memories, but it&#8217;s  time to move on&#8230;Mutual decision&#8230;Looking forward to BRIGHT future!</p></blockquote>
<p>The future&#8217;s so bright he has to wear shades&#8230; everywhere he goes&#8230; even indoors.</p>
<p>This one is less of a surprise. Phil was never as public in addressing UB&#8217;s problems as Annie was, and recently he&#8217;d stopped appearing in public with the UB logo.</p>
<p>Again, it&#8217;s hard for me to believe that this was purely a PR/branding decision. Although the man practically invented the idea of a poker celebrity, the UB brand was at its worst years ago but he is just now leaving. It was all about the money for him, even moreso than for Annie, and presumably they can no longer pay him what he believes himself to be worth.</p>
<p>These two announcements lend urgency to <a href="https://www.thinkingpoker.net/2010/12/the-reid-bill/">a warning I made earlier this month</a>:</p>
<blockquote><p>When [disreputable sites like Cereus] decide to close up shop, it will likely be without warning,  and they may well take your money down with them. This wouldn’t even  have to entail outright theft, though I wouldn’t put that past them,  either. An unexpected occurrence such as a major crackdown on their  payment processors could render them suddenly illiquid. If you believe  that Cereus keeps player deposits in a separate account that is not used  for operating expenses, I have some real estate to sell you in  Florida….</p></blockquote>
<p>Joe Sebok is <a href="http://www.pokernews.com/news/2010/12/hellmuth-and-duke-out-at-ub-9577.htm" target="_blank" rel="noopener">still drinking the Kool-Aid</a>:</p>
<blockquote><p>Speaking of Team UB, while it&#8217;s true that two of our members have moved  on, don&#8217;t think that we aren&#8217;t restocking the talent.  We&#8217;ll be  announcing our newest Team UB member next week and I am crazily pumped  about it.  UB has, and will continue to have, a whole new look and feel  for our team and our newest signing exemplifies that, so stay tuned for  that announcement next week.  Going to be a bit of a doozy.</p></blockquote>
<p>In related news, I&#8217;ve got a big announcement to make tomorrow <img src="https://s.w.org/images/core/emoji/17.0.2/72x72/1f642.png" alt="🙂" class="wp-smiley" style="height: 1em; max-height: 1em;" /></p>
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			<slash:comments>7</slash:comments>
		
		
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		<title>The Reid Bill</title>
		<link>https://www.thinkingpoker.net/2010/12/the-reid-bill/</link>
					<comments>https://www.thinkingpoker.net/2010/12/the-reid-bill/#comments</comments>
		
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Andrew]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 09 Dec 2010 22:45:54 +0000</pubDate>
				<category><![CDATA[Poker News]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[cereus]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[Full Tilt Poker]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[Harrah's]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[harry reid]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[Las Vegas]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[legislation]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[news]]></category>
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		<category><![CDATA[poker players alliance]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[Poker Stars]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[senator kyl]]></category>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thinkingpoker.net/?p=6432</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Obviously I&#8217;ve been closely following discussions of the &#8220;Reid Bill&#8221; that would pave the way for licensing of US-based online poker operations following a &#8220;blackout period&#8221; during which it would be unlawful to offer such games to American players. I ... <a class="read-more" href="https://www.thinkingpoker.net/2010/12/the-reid-bill/">Read more...</a>]]></description>
										<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Obviously I&#8217;ve been closely following discussions of the &#8220;Reid Bill&#8221; that would pave the way for licensing of US-based online poker operations following a &#8220;blackout period&#8221; during which it would be unlawful to offer such games to American players. I have no inside knowledge of the issue myself, but I believe I am well-qualified to sort through the conflicting opinions on this legislation and reach the following tentative conclusions:</p>
<p><strong>Prospects Are Bleak</strong></p>
<p>The online poker language is not in the tax cuts bill that is going to the floor for a vote. Reid is talking about trying to attach it to something else, but this seriously hurts its prospects for passage. Many on 2+2 are relieved by that, but I am not so sure it is good news. The picture of an unregulated future painted by both the Poker Players Alliance (PPA) and others in the know is rather bleak.</p>
<p><strong>The Status Quo is Bad and Getting Worse</strong></p>
<p>This is the major point that the bill&#8217;s detractors largely fail to acknowledge. Things are not just fine as they are now. It may seem that way, especially if you are a small stakes player who hasn&#8217;t dealt with moving large sums of money, but the sites that still serve US players face major hurdles in doing so.</p>
<p>The Department of Justice, in shutting down the payment processors that move money back and forth between online poker sites and American players, has greatly increased the cost of doing business for the sites. Not only must they continue to find new and ever more shady (and presumably expensive, given the risks they are running) processors, but they must also eat the costs every time the DOJ seizes funds from a processor. Every time you hear about a processor getting shut down and tens of thousands of dollars seized, that is players&#8217; money that the sites, to date, have always reimbursed in the interest of keeping business flowing. There may come a time when a site decides it is no longer worth it to keep reimbursing these funds and will simply send an e-mail to affected players: &#8220;Your withdrawal of $XXX has been seized by the US Department of Justice. If you wish to dispute this seizure, you can file Form DJ-889-7b in triplicate with the DOJ within 30 days of this notice. Thanks for playing at Cereus!&#8221;</p>
<p>If you aren&#8217;t aware of these payment processor complications, it&#8217;s because you have always dealt in small (&lt;$2500) transactions and/or because the sites do their best to insulate you from these difficulties. No matter how bad things get for them and how much money they are putting up on your behalf, their incentive is still to convey the sense that all is well and you can continue to play worry-free. They are shouldering the risk themselves, and while they are certainly being well-compensated for that, there will eventually come a point at which the cost of doing business is simply too high.</p>
<p>So far, it&#8217;s only been money at risk, and the sites are making enough of that. Should the DOJ start indicting the individuals believed to own these sites, those individuals may lose their will to fight in a hurry. This is a particular risk for Full Tilt Poker, with its purported owners living high-profile lives in the United States.</p>
<p>My point is that there probably will not be much warning beyond what we&#8217;ve already seen. The sites have no incentive to hint at the complications they currently face, as this would only cost them business. Think Netteller. Everything will be fine until one day it isn&#8217;t.</p>
<p><strong>Professional Poker Players Have No Bargaining Power</strong></p>
<p>The PPA has done an admirable job of marshalling what influence it has. <a href="https://www.thinkingpoker.net/2010/11/let-them-pump-gas/">Some politicians are more honest about this than others</a>, but the unpleasant reality is that nobody gives a shit whether you can make a living playing online poker. We are not in a position to dictate the terms under which online poker is licensed and regulated in the United States.</p>
<p>Those decisions will be made by interests and lobbies far more powerful than we. Whatever happens with online poker in the long-term will be the result of negotiation between social conservatives who generally oppose gaming and major US-based gaming organizations such as Harrah&#8217;s. Foreign sites like Poker Stars and Full Tilt Poker do not get a seat at the table, and those of us whose who earn a living at the virtual tables don&#8217;t either.</p>
<p>The influence of gaming companies, especially in Reid&#8217;s state of Nevada, is immense. They literally <em>are</em> the economy of that state, employing a tremendous proportion of the population and generating much of the state&#8217;s revenue. We are not in a position to dictate anything to them. The best we can hope to do is capitalize on the ways in which our interests align.<br />
<strong><br />
This Bill is the Best We Are Going to Get</strong></p>
<p>Democrats lost a lot of ground in the mid-term elections, including control of the <span style="text-decoration: line-through;">Senate</span> House Finance Committee and the House of Representatives. This bill is far from ideal for the professional player, but there is no reason to think that we are in a position to hold out for something better. Even individual Republicans who themselves have no ideological objection to gaming still have trouble supporting it for fear of alienating socially conservative constituents. If this bill fails, then we will have to hope that Democrats rally in 2012 and bother to revist this issue, and even if all of that happens, they are still going to be beholden to the US-based gaming industry, which is still going to insist on preferential treatment.</p>
<p>Even to talk about our &#8220;holding out&#8221; for something better is naive, because the truth is that our consent isn&#8217;t needed or wanted. We aren&#8217;t in a position to block this legislation even if we wanted to. Whether we professionals like it or not is immaterial.</p>
<p>As an academic matter, should we like it? The &#8220;blackout period&#8221; is unfortunate but not unworkable. I sympathize with the many pros are not able to absorb 15 months&#8217; of vastly diminished income, but in the long run it&#8217;s a price worth paying for licensed online poker that can be advertised on US television, funded by US banks, etc.</p>
<p>Is the &#8220;blackout period&#8221; a deal-breaker? Perhaps not. It seems that Senator Kyl, not the gaming companies, is the source of this provision (though he still opposes even this version of the bill). He is a powerful adversary and not an easy one to move, but there are powerful and monied interests on the other side of this issue as well. The best we can hope for is a last-minute compromise on this point, but even if it can&#8217;t be achieved, the impression I get is that a bill containing blackout language will be better than no bill at all.</p>
<p>Other provisions, such as the size of the tax on revenues, are generally considered to be more than reasonable. Considering how hard governments rake their lotteries, we may even be getting off easy on this point. Given the opportunity, would we want to trade the blackout period for far higher taxation? I wouldn&#8217;t think so, which is all the more reason to prefer this bill.</p>
<p>The prohibition on non-US players, once a US-based market gets up and running, is the part I find most puzzling. I suppose keeping everything domestic makes matters much simpler, but it also forfeits billions of dollars in potential revenue. From the perspective of the US government, revenue from non-citizens is far more valuable than revenue from citizens, and if anything about the bill changes in the next few years, I would expect it to be this.</p>
<p><strong>What Can We Do About It?</strong></p>
<p>At the legislative level, very little. Pardon my cynicism, but the major decisions will be made by interests far stronger than us. We may have some room at the margins to haggle with details (according to the PPA, they were able to do away with pernalites for players on illegal sites that appeared in an early draft of the bill), but we simply don&#8217;t have the influence to fight the US gaming industry on their core interests, which unfortunately do include getting a leg-up on their foreign competition.</p>
<p>There is speculation that, should this legislation pass, it may be possible to play on second-tier sites such as Bodog and Cereus during the blackout period. I would advise you to be very careful if you do so. The long-term prospects of these sites will not be good in a world where they must compete, without access to the US market, against not just Poker Stars and Full Tilt but also gaming giants like Harrah&#8217;s.</p>
<p>Their incentive will likely be to make what short-term profits they can before being driven out of business by some combination of the DOJ and their competition. When they decide to close up shop, it will likely be without warning, and they may well take your money down with them. This wouldn&#8217;t even have to entail outright theft, though I wouldn&#8217;t put that past them, either. An unexpected occurrence such as a major crackdown on their payment processors could render them suddenly illiquid. If you believe that Cereus keeps player deposits in a separate account that is not used for operating expenses, I have some real estate to sell you in Florida&#8230;.</p>
<p>If you are a professional poker player in the United States, this legislation should be a wake-up call for you whether it passes or not. You need substantial savings. You need a back-up plan. You need to know where your money is and how safe it is there. Poker Stars and Full Tilt Poker are huge companies with solid long-term prospects that are not entirely dependent on the US market. Even if they stop serving US players, and even in the absence of legislation this is a realistic possiblity, especially for FTP, they are not likely to abscond with your money. The same cannot be said for smaller sites, especially those with a history of putting short-term profits above honest dealings with their customers.</p>
<p>There are no guarantees. As poker players, we ought to be accustomed to managing risk and making decisions with imperfect information. For my money, this legislation is the best bet we have. The next year or two may well be lean years for us, but if the eventual licensing and regulation of online poker in the US is handled well (this is also not a guarantee), then such a bill will be very good for us in the long-term.</p>
<p>In the absence of legislation, things will continue as usual for a few months, maybe even few years, but they will get very bad in the not-too-distant future. I fear that should that happen, we will all look back wistfully at this window of opportunity and regret that the &#8220;Reid Bill&#8221; didn&#8217;t pass. By then, we may be forced to settle for much worse legislation or even a worst-case scenario where the DOJ aggressively shuts down online poker sites serving US customers, seizes funds, and actively prosecutes players themselves.</p>
<p>Edit: Changed &#8220;Senate&#8221; to &#8220;House&#8221; with regard to which Finance Committee the Dems lose in January.</p>
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		<item>
		<title>More Cereus Clownage</title>
		<link>https://www.thinkingpoker.net/2010/08/more-cereus-clownage/</link>
					<comments>https://www.thinkingpoker.net/2010/08/more-cereus-clownage/#comments</comments>
		
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Andrew]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 28 Aug 2010 18:33:26 +0000</pubDate>
				<category><![CDATA[Poker News]]></category>
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		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thinkingpoker.net/?p=5807</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Their flawless software that is now the best and most secure in the industry apparently produced this little gem in the UBOC O/8 event the other day. The bet sizes were all screwed up, enabling people to limp in for ... <a class="read-more" href="https://www.thinkingpoker.net/2010/08/more-cereus-clownage/">Read more...</a>]]></description>
										<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><a rel="attachment wp-att-5808" href="https://www.thinkingpoker.net/2010/08/more-cereus-clownage/majorfail/"><img fetchpriority="high" decoding="async" class="aligncenter size-full wp-image-5808" title="majorfail" src="https://www.thinkingpoker.net/images//majorfail.jpg" alt="" width="640" height="480" srcset="https://www.thinkingpoker.net/images/majorfail.jpg 640w, https://www.thinkingpoker.net/images/majorfail-150x113.jpg 150w, https://www.thinkingpoker.net/images/majorfail-300x225.jpg 300w, https://www.thinkingpoker.net/images/majorfail-600x450.jpg 600w" sizes="(max-width: 640px) 100vw, 640px" /></a></p>
<p>Their flawless software that is now the best and most secure in the industry apparently produced this little gem in the UBOC O/8 event the other day. The bet sizes were all screwed up, enabling people to limp in for 15 at the 50/100 level, and for the player in the Big Blind to move all in. Their response was to cancel the tournament, refund buy-ins, and offer a freeroll for affected players with about $10,000 in UBOC championship event buy-ins added.</p>
<p>Thanks to <a href="http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/29/news-views-gossip/another-ub-software-glitch-861994/" target="_blank" rel="noopener">TwoPlusTwo poster FreeFalling</a> for this awesome image!</p>
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